Newbie Questions about Copper Plating

[TonyStarks]

Hello everyone! I'm new to the world of plating; I've read a decent amount about it but this is my first time trying it out and I'm certainly far from knowing everything I need to know. So, please excuse what might be some newbie questions but I've had some trouble finding answers.

I'm attempting to copper plate screws for a project I am doing. The copper is for aesthetic purposes. I have the plug n' plate kit which I figured was enough for plating several screws and thumbscrews.

I have made several DIP PLATING attempts. All of the screws I have made attempts with so far are stainless steel. Some of the attempts come out with a plating that is somewhat dark with areas that are very dark-- it then will rub right off if I rub on it with a tissue. Does this mean that I'm burning it? Or is this the opposite-- not enough? I do know that with the plug and plate system I need to play around with how much of the wand is submerged and how much surface area is being plated; I just don't know what the results I've seen mean exactly.

The better looking parts of the screws I've tried come out with a very matte orange/pinkish look to them. From what I've read in some other posts I think that this is what it should look like but I'm not totally sure about that.

Second plating question I have is that I tried one screw completely unpolished and another that I sanded and polished to a much shinier cleaner surface. The screw I polished came out with black streaks or marks where I had polished it whereas the unchanged (a very matted, unpolished surface) screw came out looking better. Is there some reason for this?

I did do some limited preparation before plating in terms of degreasing and making sure I didn't get any skin oil on them. But this does bring me to my next question which is what precisely would be the best preparation process for plating screws with copper like I am attempting to do?

And lastly, if anyone has any good tips for the best way to sand/buff/polish screws I would certainly love to hear anything anyone might have to say! It's really only the heads of the screws that need to look nice so I'm primarily interested with help on preparing the screw heads.

Thank you in advance for taking the time to read my post and offering your much appreciated help. I look forward to learning more!

Cheers!

S.

edit: my latest attempt that I just checked has pretty much the same problems as described above but on the head of one of the screws there is a small 2mm circle of copper plate that looks nice and coppery . . nice and metallic . . not sure what's up? I'm sure I'm doing something completely newbishly wrong but I guess everyone's got to start somewhere!

[woodjames]

We all start as newbies, no need to apologize!

First off, you never mentioned if you were using flash copper of acid copper, as that will make a huge difference.
I'll assume we're talking flash, so here goes-
You're burning it. Try doing a few of them as a time, that may help to ''absorb'' some of the extra power. Second, stainless is pretty tricky to plate because of the oxide layer that forms, try another metal for practice, that may be just as much of your problem. An oxidized layer will take plating, however it just falls right off, similar to trying to plate onto rust if you can envision that.
As far as buffing goes, copper is really soft so it doesn't take to much to get a highly reflective surface. If it were me, and I only had a few to do, I'd probably chuck the threads in a drill, apply some polish to a piece of felt and buff by hand as it was rotating. I'd stay away from buffing machines as it's really easy to launch small pieces.

The copper will look salmon colored when done correctly.

Hello everyone! I'm new to the world of plating; I've read a decent amount about it but this is my first time trying it out and I'm certainly far from knowing everything I need to know. So, please excuse what might be some newbie questions but I've had some trouble finding answers.

I'm attempting to copper plate screws for a project I am doing. The copper is for aesthetic purposes. I have the plug n' plate kit which I figured was enough for plating several screws and thumbscrews.

I have made several DIP PLATING attempts. All of the screws I have made attempts with so far are stainless steel. Some of the attempts come out with a plating that is somewhat dark with areas that are very dark-- it then will rub right off if I rub on it with a tissue. Does this mean that I'm burning it? Or is this the opposite-- not enough? I do know that with the plug and plate system I need to play around with how much of the wand is submerged and how much surface area is being plated; I just don't know what the results I've seen mean exactly.

The better looking parts of the screws I've tried come out with a very matte orange/pinkish look to them. From what I've read in some other posts I think that this is what it should look like but I'm not totally sure about that.

Second plating question I have is that I tried one screw completely unpolished and another that I sanded and polished to a much shinier cleaner surface. The screw I polished came out with black streaks or marks where I had polished it whereas the unchanged (a very matted, unpolished surface) screw came out looking better. Is there some reason for this?

I did do some limited preparation before plating in terms of degreasing and making sure I didn't get any skin oil on them. But this does bring me to my next question which is what precisely would be the best preparation process for plating screws with copper like I am attempting to do?

And lastly, if anyone has any good tips for the best way to sand/buff/polish screws I would certainly love to hear anything anyone might have to say! It's really only the heads of the screws that need to look nice so I'm primarily interested with help on preparing the screw heads.

Thank you in advance for taking the time to read my post and offering your much appreciated help. I look forward to learning more!

Cheers!

S.

edit: my latest attempt that I just checked has pretty much the same problems as described above but on the head of one of the screws there is a small 2mm circle of copper plate that looks nice and coppery . . nice and metallic . . not sure what's up? I'm sure I'm doing something completely newbishly wrong but I guess everyone's got to start somewhere!

[TonyStarks]

Hello James

Thank you so much for your answer and help. It is Flash Copper solution that I am using. So, when I get darkened areas and the plating easily rubs off that is a sign that it's burning? Just out of curiosity, so I know for the future, what are the symptoms of insufficient amperage? Just that it's not plating at all? Also, I notice that in the instructions, it mentions to make sure that the copper wand not be too close to the objects being plated-- how close is too close? Again, for everything I'm talking about here, we're talking about copper plating screws.

Also, If I want to plate some aluminum with copper, if I understand correctly, there is absolutely no way of doing that at all with this plug n' plate (flash copper solution) kit? Is that correct? I would have to get a power supply and one of the larger kits?

And, just to be sure, a correctly, successfully copper plated item should be salmon pink . . but what texture? Should it be really matte and sort of "chalkboard" feeling when I rub my nail on it (for lack of better description)?

And lastly, could someone describe the proper preparation with the proper materials that I should be using . . in terms of cleaning and degreasing? Just want to be sure on that.

Thank you so much!

Warm Regards,

Stephan


Edit - Also, it is correct that I DO NOT need the stainless steel activator for the plug n' plate copper kit that I'm using? That's what I was told when I talked to someone at Caswell on the phone.

[woodjames]

As far as the burning, you may find that without being able to adjust the voltage, you won't be able to correctly do it, it's really designed for brush plating.
If you went too low with the power it won't fully plate the piece, or would just take a lot longer to get sufficient build, but for the surface area you're talking it really wouldn't be applicable. If you're dip plating, much like tank plating in mini - keep the anode(wand) as far away as you can. You'd probably be okay doing a dip plate with aluminum, but definitely wouldn't be able to do it with brush plating. Surface texture sounds okay. I can't give you an answer on the stainless as surface prep has a lot of variables, but can tell you that if it sticks - you're doing it right!
As far as the cleaning, there's a lot of old threads there, you're best bet is to search through.

Hello James

Thank you so much for your answer and help. It is Flash Copper solution that I am using. So, when I get darkened areas and the plating easily rubs off that is a sign that it's burning? Just out of curiosity, so I know for the future, what are the symptoms of insufficient amperage? Just that it's not plating at all? Also, I notice that in the instructions, it mentions to make sure that the copper wand not be too close to the objects being plated-- how close is too close? Again, for everything I'm talking about here, we're talking about copper plating screws.

Also, If I want to plate some aluminum with copper, if I understand correctly, there is absolutely no way of doing that at all with this plug n' plate (flash copper solution) kit? Is that correct? I would have to get a power supply and one of the larger kits?

And, just to be sure, a correctly, successfully copper plated item should be salmon pink . . but what texture? Should it be really matte and sort of "chalkboard" feeling when I rub my nail on it (for lack of better description)?

And lastly, could someone describe the proper preparation with the proper materials that I should be using . . in terms of cleaning and degreasing? Just want to be sure on that.

Thank you so much!

Warm Regards,

Stephan


Edit - Also, it is correct that I DO NOT need the stainless steel activator for the plug n' plate copper kit that I'm using? That's what I was told when I talked to someone at Caswell on the phone.

[TonyStarks]

Thanks, again, James, for the help!

So, if proper, successful copper plating does come out salmon colored with a rough matte texture, how do I get from there to a shiny, reflective copper that looks more like what a piece of polished copper bar looks like? Again, I'm sorry for what probably are simple questions to many . . but I guess I'm a bit lost in how to obtain the outcome I'm seeking.

I'm building a high end custom computer with copper in the color scheme. I have many parts that are made of copper and are a nice shiny copper finish. I am trying to get the heads of these screws to look like that or as close as I can get. The finish I'm getting now looks more like salmon colored clay . . best way I can describe it . . it doesn't look metal.

Also, some of my attempts developed dark splotches on them over night that were not there last night . . what is causing this?

I took some pictures to hopefully help you guys see what I'm doing wrong because I have the feeling I'm doing a few things incorrectly:


http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/5324/img1084p.jpg

http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/9050/img1087h.jpg

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/5541/img1088cfm.jpg

http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/5161/img1089h.jpg

http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/4138/img1090r.jpg

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/4887/img1091w.jpg


THANKS for the help!!!!!

Cheers!

Stephan

[woodjames]

Those don't look to bad, they look like you're still over-juicing them, just not to the point where they're burning, that and there are no brighteners or levelers in the electrolyte to help make them shiny right out of the tank. Those are little nodules, the manual describes them as coral like growths which is a good description if you let them go for a long time. Get some 1000 grit sandpaper and some clear coat safe auto rubbing compound, you'll get them shiny in no time. Dark blotches are no big deal, a little oxidation is all. When you get the rubbing compound, buy some wax at the same time. Caswell sells Collinite metal wax which works really good, but to get you buy any brand of wax will work, even a candle.
I'll see if I can scrounge up some pics of before and after with my own stuff to show you you're not too far off. Be careful with the threads, you'll probably have to run a die on 'em. Try to rig up a few screws at one time, you'll find it helps.

[TonyStarks]

Thanks so much for your helpful answer James! The pictures are greatly appreciated; they are very reassuring that I'm not too far off from doing this correctly!

In terms of buffing compounds am I correct in thinking that I would use Tripoli/Brown followed by White compound to really polish copper up nicely?

Also, what do you recommend to remove oxidation/fingerprints off of copper? I found some Brasso is my stuff but I wasn't sure what you all think of that? Some of the items I need to get fingerprints off of are a bit delicate so I didn't know if that was too harsh? Certainly let me know what you recommend!


Thanks so much for the continued help!!!

[woodjames]

If you have a buffer that'll work well (the compound). I suggested high grit sandpaper/rubbing compound as if thinking you didn't have a buffer, and it's very quick/minimal investment. The brasso works well, I've used that before. But you'll have to cut if flat with the brasso as well, using a very fine sandpaper 800 grit or higher. It really doesn't take to long. After you've got it polished, use some wax on it, that'll help with finger prints. If they build up on the polished piece after a while, a ''cleaner'' wax will remove fingerprints and re-wax at the same time. You can find all the above at any chain store auto place or even walmart, and make one trip of it. McGuire's products work well, Caswell sells collinite metal wax that works well.

Thanks so much for your helpful answer James! The pictures are greatly appreciated; they are very reassuring that I'm not too far off from doing this correctly!

In terms of buffing compounds am I correct in thinking that I would use Tripoli/Brown followed by White compound to really polish copper up nicely?

Also, what do you recommend to remove oxidation/fingerprints off of copper? I found some Brasso is my stuff but I wasn't sure what you all think of that? Some of the items I need to get fingerprints off of are a bit delicate so I didn't know if that was too harsh? Certainly let me know what you recommend!


Thanks so much for the continued help!!!

[TonyStarks]

Now, by what mechanism does Brasso work anyway? Does it cut into the metal and "sand" it? Or is it like a silver polish?

And, REALLY sorry for my newbishness here but when you say "But you'll have to cut if flat with the brasso as well, using a very fine sandpaper 800 grit or higher." what do you mean exactly when you say "You'll have to cut it flat" ?

I can't thank you enough for all of your helpful answers!

Stephan

[woodjames]

The brasso isn't very aggressive, so you'll want to tackle the majority of the work by using sandpaper, very fine sandpaper. After that use the brasso by hand with some high quality charmin toilet paper, as it won't scratch like cotton of paper towels will. You can try just the brasso alone, but you'll be working it a while to make it look really good. Let the sand paper do the work for you by cutting down and smoothing out the copper, then the brasso is used to brighten things up. Do all your sanding by hand, just enough until the shiny copper comes through and the dull salmon color is gone. It only takes a pass or two. You don't want to sand through so just take it easy. If you do happen to go through, clean it up and put it back into the bath, then repeat the polishing. I've done that a few times before.

Now, by what mechanism does Brasso work anyway? Does it cut into the metal and "sand" it? Or is it like a silver polish?

And, REALLY sorry for my newbishness here but when you say "But you'll have to cut if flat with the brasso as well, using a very fine sandpaper 800 grit or higher." what do you mean exactly when you say "You'll have to cut it flat" ?

I can't thank you enough for all of your helpful answers!

Stephan